We've just started digging into heroic mythical archetypes, so I'm not sure if there is a lot to post about it yet. Either way, I wanted to set up a place for our examples of mythical heroic archetypes that we see in the literature we read.
The first books that came to my mind, aside from Harry Potter, were a series by Tamora Pierce. She writes middle-school aged books about an ancient, magical kingdom with monsters, castles, knights... the whole shabang. In particular, I was thinking about the Protector of the Small series. In these books, Kel is the main charactor. She's girl trying to be a knight in an entirely male-dominated society. She's the first girl to openly try for knightship in over a thousand years. This makes her an outcase within her community. She also has a somewhat obsucre and mysterious past because she and her family recently moved from another country. Laz also made the point that the hero or heroine must be removed from the life they knew (the threshold guardian). In the first book, Kel is unsure whether or not she wants to try out for knighthood. Later on in the week, Kel is attacked by a bunch of deadly immortals while she is walking near her home. She is unable to defend herself for long, and her brother saves her. This attack sealed her decision to try for her knighthood and learn to defend herself and others. She no longer feels protected because she knows she can't defend herself. This is a break away from the life she knew. In terms of the second point Laz made (Hero not invincible, but not a fool), Kel's charactor applies as well. She's quick on her feet and has common sense, but she has physical limitations because she is a girl (less muscle power). She also has a severe fear of heights, which becomes a challenge she has to face towards the end of the series. All of the heroic archetype points fit into this novel, but I also think I picked an easy example. These books are openly about knights, shining armor, winning love, fighting dragons. An interesting example would be one which isn't so obvious.
Comments? Other examples?
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9 comments:
Oh dear...
Once you know about the mythic heroic archetype (like the veterans from his Honors III class), you begin to see it everywhere. It's frustrating yet cool at the same time.
Some quick examples:
Die Hard
Matrix
The One
The Bourne Series
Probably any Dan Brown book you pick up.
The reason the mythic heroic archetype is present in so many stories is because we like it. As Laz said, since we see ourselves in the stories, it's tough not to let mythic heroes go and find a new archetype.
Beowulf fits into the archetype but I think it'd be better to wait until we cover all the aspects of the archetype before we make comparisons.
veterans??? more like POWs lol. jk
Anyway, since we are going to have to bring up old HP, best start now. So there's the mysterious background because no one knows why Voldemort couldn't kill him and his scar is a physical representation of this innate difference. Second, I'd say his main weakness is that he's bound by the steps Dumbledore set out for him. It is clearly evident that Harry has a average intellect, but he does possess SOME common sense.
The first archetype is obvious but our hero has other weaknesses that could be considered his main difficulty. Any other ideas?
The mythic heroic archetype will ruin, yet enhance, any piece of literature you ever read...
I don't really have much to say concerning the mythic heroic archetype since we've barely discussed it. One example would be the Count of Monte Cristo. The main character (whose name slips my mind now... I just remember him as the Count) is falsely imprisoned because a man whom the Count considered his friend accused the Count of aiding Napoleon Bonaparte after Napoleon had been banished. After escaping from prison, the Count decides to use the money that he found on the Island of Monte Cristo (an old man tipped him off about it... more about the old man to come) to reinvent himself as the Count of Monte Cristo. With this wealth and power, he will take revenge on all those who betrayed him (backstabbing of those he considered friends is the threshold). When he returns to France, no one recognizes the Count and they wonder about his mysterious background. Since he is human, the Count of course has weaknesses (love for the woman he lost, etc.) but he uses his wit and cunning to outsmart those around him and carry out his plans for revenge.
Of course any action movie or adventure novel you will ever see/read will fit this archetype.
I had a question about Harry Potter. Laz said that the "doorway" into Harry's new adventure was when Hagrid came and got him from his uncle's house. Now, I don't dare to contradict Laz, but I had a bit of a question about that...
Is it possible that there are two "doorway" points and two adventure points?
Harry's life signifigantly changes when he finds out he's a wizard.
But I don't think that this is the only threshold point. I'd see that more as the point when he decides that he's going to have to face Voldemort (somewhere around Book 4). His world completely changes when Cedric dies, and he has to mature because of it. I think this is kind of the point of really beginning the journey.
On that note, I'd like to point out something like that again. Another important point about the archetypes was the idea of an "outcast" from society. Obviously, Harry is different from the Muggles because he's a wizard. But his story doesn't take place in the Muggle world. I'd say that his "outcast" state is more evident and much more significant in the wizarding world. He's a "marked man", "The Boy Who Lived".
I'm not even sure if this post is completely coherent. I guess what I'm really trying to ask is if a story can have somewhat of a two-layer achetype set-up.
Please comment on my incoherency :)
Anisha- I think that the "doorway" refers specifically to a single event. Cedric dying is just an obstacle on the road to facing Voldemort. And Harry's decision to face Voldemort was important, but perhaps inevitable. I am sure people will argue with that. I think Harry's weakness is his attachment to friends and family. After all, it is this love that gets Sirius killed (*sniffle). What do you all (six) think?
Another fun example for the mythic heroic archetype- Braveheart. Wallace is mysterious because no one knows who he is when he shows up. He faces obstacles trying to free Scotland. And though he dies, the knowledge of freedom's importance is brought back to the community by his comrades. Not sure who the guide is, though.
If anyone has read Eragon and Eldest, they are also textbook examples.
As another scarred and bloody World War Laz vet, I would like to point out that there are very few female mythic heros. It is incredibly difficult to portray a female with the sense of isolation required for the mythic heroic archetype. Females usually have children, husbands, etc. You will find very few examples of these female heros simply because it does not seem natural. (Oh heavens! The feminists are coming for my head!) But it is true.
Who is psyched for Beowulf? I can't pronounce the names.
Do you think that stories without this mythic heroic archetype (or don't follow it) are inherently not as popular?
Anisha... To answer your HP questions...
I think the threshold is really when Hagrid knocks down the door and tells Harry that he is a wizard. At this moment, Harry's life is turned upside down completely (while at the same time making more sense) and he is forced to choose whether or not he believes in his fate as a wizard. He can choose to believe it and go to Hogwarts (which ultimately leads to his showdown with Voldemort) or he can choose to forget about the giant that just knocked down his door and go on with his life (thus never taking the path to Voldemort). However, the point you are talking about as the "second threshold" doesn't seem as viable a point to me -- on some level, I think Harry knows by this point that he and Voldemort will have to eventually engage in a final battle. I think an arguement could even be made that Harry crosses the threshold the night his parents are murdered and Voldemort "marks him as his equal."
I completely agree with your ideas on Harry's "outcast" status... it fits in with the mythic heroic archetype, yet is uniquely different than the "outsider" status of some other mythic heroes.
As for your other post, I don't think stories that don't follow the mythic heroic archetype are inherently not as popular... the tragic archetype has been around just as long as the mythic heroic archetype and occurs just about as often. I think the mythic heroic archetype appeals to us as humans more though because we want to revel in the antagonist's glory than lament his tragic demise.
any other opinions?
I'll have to agree with Liz in regards to Harry Potter.
The threshold was quite clearly illustrated by the door and Hagrid's breaking of it. While not very tragic or a big loss to Harry, he does leave everything he knows behind (the Muggle world) and goes to fulfill his destiny.
As for stories not following the archetype, I'll have to agree with Anisha. They are missing that quality of allowing the reader to immerse himself into the story. I think that's the most important part of any story. Stories that fail to do so just aren't as readable.
However, you'd be hard pressed to find a story that doesn't follow the mythic heroic archetype and that doesn't have all its characters die at the end.
One example that I was thinking of is a little unconventional. How about Jesus Christ (as a religious, not historical, figure) as part of the mythical heroic archetype? His birth is predicted beforehand, and he is conceived immaculately (supernaturally). His "guide" would be his father, God. Throughout his life he escapes many attacks and attempts to kill him, through using his own common sense and the wisdom of his guide. He also receives a divine commission, defeats evil forces, is exalted and hailed as king. Later, he is betrayed, first by Judas then by almost all those who had called him "King" and who had exalted him. He is crucified, and as he dies on the cross he cries out asking why he has been forsaken (by everyone, including his father). He is vindicated and taken up to heaven. After his death, his disciples carry on his message.
I think it's a pretty valid connection...any thoughts?
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